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transience ranks every notable character from "24". (mega spoilers) (mega-list)

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transience (tc) | Posted 5/28/2010 9:20:14 AM | message detail | delete | filter | #201
sorry
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xyzzy
SHINE GET 64 | Posted 5/28/2010 9:21:07 AM | message detail | filter | #202
PLAYlNGTHEGAME | Posted 5/28/2010 9:21:52 AM | message detail | filter | #203
im just going to assume his absence is merely you pushing an agenda for user votes and that you actually do think he is ridiculously awesome

where you putting season 8 in your final rankings?
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sess
transience (tc) | Posted 5/28/2010 9:24:25 AM | message detail | delete | filter | #204
I'm not sure yet. 7 and 8 I have a hard time ranking -- they're technically pretty good, but after 6 I found it hard to really embrace 24 in the same way. 8's got a very mediocre first half and a very good second half -- I'll probably rank it around the middle. I think I'd tentatively go 5 > 1 > 4 > 7 > 8 > 3 > 2 > 6, with 4/7/8 being pretty close together.
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xyzzy
PLAYlNGTHEGAME | Posted 5/28/2010 9:24:33 AM | message detail | filter | #205
and heres my guess for top 5

1. jack
2. logan
3. palmer
4. bill
5. marwan

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sess
PLAYlNGTHEGAME | Posted 5/28/2010 9:26:27 AM | message detail | filter | #206
i think 6 made me biased towards 7 because there was such a discrepancy in goodness that i completely ate 7 up

i think that also happened with the first half and second half of 8 too
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sess
SenpaiDessus | Posted 5/28/2010 9:33:42 AM | message detail | filter | #207
tran i know exactly what you mean about the effect of S6

i'm not sure how objectively bad it is, but it killed the momentum of 24 so badly, and considering just how goddamn much momentum we entered with, that does speak badly of it

one thing that bothered me about S6 is that it made 24 feel old - like we'd seen every trick in the book. S4/S5 had a lot of 'technically repetitive' sequences i'm sure, but it still felt fresh. after S6, and i say this with complete confidence, even some of the greatest parts of S7/8 began to feel just a little trite.
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transience (tc) | Posted 5/28/2010 9:34:39 AM | message detail | delete | filter | #208
yeah I'm the other way around. after the nonsense of 6, seeing Zombie Tony running around as a terrorist made me super skeptical. if they had done that after season 5, I could have dealt with it a little better, but after Phil and Graem Bauer is was tough to keep a straight face.

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xyzzy
transience (tc) | Posted 5/28/2010 9:36:08 AM | message detail | delete | filter | #209
yeah I agree with that too. the last great interrogation is in season 6. after that we just started yelling at people and pulling off body parts immediately. there was a lot of subtlety lost after season 5 -- instead of having buildup, we just walk up to Milo and shoot him in the face. because that innocence was lost, I have a hell of a time being fair to seasons 7 and 8.
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xyzzy
transience (tc) | Posted 5/28/2010 9:43:09 AM | message detail | delete | filter | #210
53. Karen Hayes
Season(s): 5, 6
Bio: http://24.wikia.com/wiki/Karen_Hayes

Karen Hayes comes to CTU in the same way that Alberta Green, Ryan Chappelle and Lynn McGill came -- as outsiders who are there to clean things up. Karen also comes equipped with Miles Papazian which is some serious baggage. Needless to say, we came in expecting to hate Karen Hayes, and at first she's a bit obstinate, especially when the first thing that happens under her watch is Jack giving Theo Stoller the WET list.

It takes Karen a while to come around, but eventually she does - she helps out Chloe and Bill and ends up marrying Bill. In season 6, she becomes the head of Homeland Security and butts heads repeatedly with Tom Lennox until she's forced to resign. Karen manages to stay on until the very end, and she alerts Bill as to where Jack is so he can intercept the car. Karen is arrested and probably forced to resign and we never see her again.

Despite Karen being on the good guy's side, I don't think anybody really overly liked her. She always seems troubled and struggles to make good decisions. I don't think she belongs in Washington at all. That's not to say that I dislike her though. She does a great job in coming to her senses and goes directly against the Vice President when she aids CTU instead of replacing all of their personnel like she was told to do. She even goes against the President towards the end when she realizes something wonky is going on. Karen has some good qualities, but they often manifest themselves too late in the game.

52. Kevin Carroll
Season(s): 1
Bio: http://24.wikia.com/wiki/Kevin_Carroll

I should just call him Alan York. Kevin Carroll is the first major plot twist in 24. When Nina calls Teri to tell her that the dead body they ID'd is Alan York, it's the biggest "ohhhhhhh crap" moment in the series up to that point. If you put Kevin Carroll's character in a different season, it wouldn't be nearly as effective, but for season 1 it's perfect.

Kevin Carroll himself really isn't all that special. He does a great job imitating Alan York and he's thoroughly convincing. He never presses Teri and he lays off of Jack instead of trying to get information out of him. His heel turn -- when he kills Janet York -- is legitimately great. His relationship with Jack is good too. When he gets in the limo with Ted Cofell and sees Jack, he doesn't even really try to resist. He just tells him that they need to go. Kevin Carroll was always small-time and it was never more clear than when he met Alexis Drazen and got himself killed, but he was a good mole.
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xyzzy
PLAYlNGTHEGAME | Posted 5/28/2010 9:57:11 AM | message detail | filter | #211
you dont like the interrogations of pavel or burnett #2?
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sess
SenpaiDessus | Posted 5/28/2010 10:00:13 AM | message detail | filter | #212
(that reminds me - i'm assuming pavel and burnett aren't on this list, right?)
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transience (tc) | Posted 5/28/2010 10:02:12 AM | message detail | delete | filter | #213
they're not, no. I don't like them nearly as much as Ted Cofell or Christopher Henderson or Joe Prado, no. those ones had some buildup to them. Pavel and Burnett are just straight torture.
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xyzzy
SenpaiDessus | Posted 5/28/2010 10:06:37 AM | message detail | filter | #214
pretty sure sess was talking about the second burnett 'interrogation,' where jack just walks into the room and burnett starts freaking out. i loved that myself.

i also really liked pavel, though in the sense that i enjoyed jack's turning into the villain full time and not for the 'excitement' of the interrogation scenes you listed.
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transience (tc) | Posted 5/28/2010 10:12:26 AM | message detail | delete | filter | #215
yeah, thinking about it, Burnett's is good. there's some buildup there and Jack has a limited amount of time. it's not just beating people up for fun.

you liked Pavel? that accent of his killed him for me immediately

you know what mini-boss I liked a lot? John Quinn
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xyzzy
PLAYlNGTHEGAME | Posted 5/28/2010 10:12:52 AM | message detail | filter | #216
just for tha record even though i have my disagreements this is a great topic man!
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sess
htaeD | Posted 5/28/2010 11:25:19 AM | message detail | filter | #217
you liked Prado's torture?
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PLAYlNGTHEGAME | Posted 5/28/2010 11:28:44 AM | message detail | filter | #218
prados was great

the only 'torture' i didnt like was vosslers wife

the whole baby thing was just awkward
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sess
transience (tc) | Posted 5/28/2010 11:37:04 AM | message detail | delete | filter | #219
"this'll help you with the pain."

yeah, I liked Prado's torture.
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xyzzy
The Beginning | Posted 5/28/2010 12:10:56 PM | message detail | filter | #220
The actor for Carroll was going to be Jack before they knew they could get Kiefer... imagine that.
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FFDragon | Posted 5/28/2010 12:14:23 PM | message detail | filter | #221
I'd rather not.
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LordEmbok | Posted 5/28/2010 5:22:54 PM | message detail | filter | #222
very slowly catching up - i would have put nadia a bit higher, i liked her plotline with milo. plus she's hot, yeah.

only thing that jumps out so far
SuperWhiscash | Posted 5/28/2010 5:40:00 PM | message detail | filter | #223
I'd put Carroll higher. for small-time, he was excellent. karen and kate maybe a bit higher too - guess i should see who's above them first.
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SenpaiDessus | Posted 5/28/2010 5:45:35 PM | message detail | filter | #224
you liked Pavel? that accent of his killed him for me immediately

as a character he wasn't anything special, but he made it through a ton of torture and verified novakovitch's assertion that 'pavel is a good soldier.' that scene wasn't great for the typical torture techniques jack uses but for the way it shows how jack is just falling apart at the edges. the pleasure that jack takes in gutting pavel is proof that he's stepped quite clearly into villain territory.

(and man S8 had a ton of really bad accents - i was immune to them by the time pavel rolled 'round.)

you know what mini-boss I liked a lot? John Quinn

john quinn was rockin'. he also gives hodges a great moment where hodges is like 'ooh, quinn's good... bauer's good too!' it's one of hodges's first scenes and you just realize that this guy loves a good fight as much as we do, and the showdown doesn't disappoint.
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Gandhi loved you, and look what happened to Gandhi.
KleenexTissue50 | Posted 5/28/2010 5:50:15 PM | message detail | filter | #225
TTF | Posted 5/28/2010 5:58:16 PM | message detail | filter | #226
My top 5:

1. Jack
2. Chloe
3. Edgar Styles
4. Nina Myers (*ducks*)
5. George Mason
TTF | Posted 5/28/2010 5:59:16 PM | message detail | filter | #227
Eeeps, Edgar Stiles, not Styles
Buzzup | Posted 5/28/2010 5:59:59 PM | message detail | filter | #228
Mike Novick better be high up, really miss that guy.
transients | Posted 5/28/2010 6:00:49 PM | message detail | filter | #229
oh man, I loved that Hodges line. we won't be seeing Hodges for a while still.
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xyzzy
LordEmbok | Posted 5/28/2010 6:02:08 PM | message detail | filter | #230
'kay caught up.

yeah when i did my rewatch of 1-6, carl webb was a guy i hoped to see more of. he would have gone well with logan, or hell, even daniels.
TTF | Posted 5/28/2010 6:03:11 PM | message detail | filter | #231
Mike Novick better be high up, really miss that guy

Definitely. Curtis Manning too.
TheRock1525 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:03:36 PM | message detail | filter | #232

From: transients | #229
oh man, I loved that Hodges line. we won't be seeing Hodges for a while still.


Good man.

I'm surprised Saunders hasn't popped up yet, mainly cause a lot of people didn't care for him. Is his daughter on the list?
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Janus5000 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:04:21 PM | message detail | filter | #233
I keep checking this topic to see where characters I know land. Miraculously I've only managed to spoil small bits of season 3 and nothing else. Good to see my two favorite villains from the first three seasons (Gaines and Ramon) still in.
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KleenexTissue50 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:05:04 PM | message detail | filter | #234
I'm surprised Saunders hasn't popped up yet, mainly cause a lot of people didn't care for him.

Bad people.

Very bad people.
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TheRock1525 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:06:22 PM | message detail | filter | #235

From: KleenexTissue50 | #234
I'm surprised Saunders hasn't popped up yet, mainly cause a lot of people didn't care for him.

Bad people.

Very bad people.


Honestly, I just love that final scene where Jack threatens to send Saunders' daughter into the hotel. That was probably Jack at his most evil prior to this season.
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transients | Posted 5/28/2010 6:10:13 PM | message detail | filter | #236
Janus, you should get the hell out of this topic. trust me on this.
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xyzzy
KleenexTissue50 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:10:48 PM | message detail | filter | #237
TheRock1525 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:11:23 PM | message detail | filter | #238
Can I stay?
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TheRock1525 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:19:12 PM | message detail | filter | #239
When your daughter is infected, I'm gonna make you watch her die.
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Janus5000 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:20:02 PM | message detail | filter | #240
Okay.

I think I just lucked out - I just accidentally read that Saunders has a daughter... and then had this revealed on the show immediately afterward.
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TheRock1525 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:20:59 PM | message detail | filter | #241
Oh shoot, I didn't realize you were doing a watch-through.

My bad.
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TTF | Posted 5/28/2010 6:22:10 PM | message detail | filter | #242
Grossest part of that Day was when Gael Ortega starts bleeding heavily through his nose. IT'S EVERYWHERE!
transients | Posted 5/28/2010 6:29:28 PM | message detail | filter | #243
51. Dana Walsh
Season(s): 8
Bio: http://24.wikia.com/wiki/Dana_Walsh

Okay, here goes.

Dana Walsh's plotline in the first half of s8 is just miserable. Kevin Wade is an okay character, but everything involving Dana is just terrible. She's got a second identity as an ex-con and gets blackmailed by her ex-boyfriend. She's marrying pretty boy Cole Ortiz, and when he finds out about her past, goes to help her and kills Kevin and her friend. Then there's a parole officer trying to find Kevin that keeps poking her head around. The dumb plotlines never end. Dana is super annoying at this point, not because of her character but because of how bad the story is and how there is absolutely no payoff. Dana Walsh twelve episodes in is a disaster.

And then it happens: Dana Walsh kills the parole officer and just like that, she's the spitting image of Nina Myers.

She has every positive Nina Myers trait. She's extremely evasive. She uses relationships with people against them. She lies so well that I have a hell of a time telling if she's telling the truth or not, even when I'm programmed not to believe a single thing she said. She picks up on Jack and how he's out of control and tells the truth to others about him. Dana practically turns Cole against Jack and knew what Jack was up to before the audience did. When she was initially captured, it was a recreation of the end of season 1 when Jack caught Nina. When Cole, Dana and Jack go to the bank, she gets away in a very Nina-esque fashion and her chase scene is great. When Jack does catch her, her death scene is *very* reminiscent of Nina's - her defenseless, Jack killing her anyway. All it needed was "you don't have any more information, do you"

Those two episodes with Dana, Cole and Jack working together are great and it's all because of Dana, one of the most infuriating characters of season 8.

50. Syed Ali
Season(s): 2
Bio: http://24.wikia.com/wiki/Syed_Ali

Syed Ali reminds me of Sephiroth. He has an incredible amount of hype, from the very first episode, without ever showing his face. People talk about him as this Keyzer Soze-like figure - never been seen, the man in control of the nuclear bomb that's going to blow up Los Angeles. When we finally see him, it's when Kate and her detective friend are being brutally tortured, and he's in all black. He even looks like the devil.

Unfortunately, Ali's reign lasts like two episodes. Jack looks at a man's pants and somehow decides it's not Ali, then captures him. Ali is imposing and threatening, but Jack threatens his family - a first in 24 for Jack - and pretends to kill one. Ali's facial expressions during the torture scene are great. Jack and Ali's dynamics are also really good - two guys who have been through hell and can relate despite being on opposite sides. Jack's interrogation of Ali is fantastic.

And just like that, Ali is gone - sent away to CTU and then taken out by a sniper. It's hard to believe he's the big boss of season 2 with such little screen time. The only legit villain of season 2 didn't get enough time to shine.
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xyzzy
KleenexTissue50 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:32:36 PM | message detail | filter | #244
Jack looks at a man's pants and somehow decides it's not Ali

best
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SenpaiDessus | Posted 5/28/2010 6:45:16 PM | message detail | filter | #245
Kevin Wade is an okay character, but everything involving Dana is just terrible.

^5

in the end i might like post-heel-turn dana more than nina myers (was never a big nina fan). however, i have to object to 'dana knew what jack was up to before anyone else' - i don't think jack himself knew he was out for vengeance when dana that trash talk at him. i think jack was still focused on justice first at that point. it's only when dana escapes cole, shoots civilians, and tries to kill jack personally that jack's patience and tolerance just totally snap. i think a similar thing happened with nina, where it was after nina killed three doctors and threatened kim's life that jack finally went over the edge and killed her in cold blood.

Jack looks at a man's pants and somehow decides it's not Ali, then captures him.

**** yeah, amazing jack moment
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TheRock1525 | Posted 5/28/2010 6:54:11 PM | message detail | filter | #246
I'm amazed that they actually were able to make me feel sorry for Dana after she was captured.
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FFDragon | Posted 5/28/2010 6:56:30 PM | message detail | filter | #247
Dana gets points for telling Cole exactly how Jack is going to kill her, and then 40 minutes later Jack does just that.
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SenpaiDessus | Posted 5/28/2010 6:57:16 PM | message detail | filter | #248
Dana gets points for telling Cole exactly how Jack is going to kill her, and then 40 minutes later Jack does just that.

self-fulfilling prophecy imo.
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transients | Posted 5/28/2010 6:58:44 PM | message detail | filter | #249
I think Jack was on the revenge path the second Taylor shot him down at CTU. at that point it was "okay, the president does not care about justice, so I'm just going to wipe out every last person involved with this. Renee Walker will not be an acceptable loss."

we just didn't know it until he shot Dana in cold blood. Dana was a step ahead of us.
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xyzzy
FFDragon | Posted 5/28/2010 7:00:46 PM | message detail | filter | #250
I was pretty sold on ROGUE BAUER after he held up CTU and jacked their helicopter. But yeah, him gunning down Dana was like the point of no return.
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